I was going to pile on but the point he makes is actually sound

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22 Responses to I was going to pile on but the point he makes is actually sound

  1. C.L. says:

    Thanks again to Boambee John for the link.

    There is indeed a disconnect today between advancement and people’s spiritual and existential sense of belonging. What was Australia’s creation of “essential” and “non-essential” humans during the ‘pandemic’ if not a utilitarian cull?

    In some ways, Harari is making a neo-Luddite case. I say that as somebody who thinks the Luddite fallacy is not a fallacy at all if you factor in the un-measurable goods economists have no interest in.

    Sinclair D’s take on this would be interesting.

  2. Boambee John says:

    CL

    Where I have concerns about this kind of comment is that the last fascist who spoke about untermensch or lebensunwertes leben actually tried to implement the policy. Will the WEF take this kind of idea seriously. I hope not, but the WEF does promulgate some strange concepts.

  3. C.L. says:

    Indeed. His choice of forum is unfortunate.
    This is really a profoundly important subject.

    It isn’t a Hitler-like final solution that worries me; I don’t think that is the danger here. The danger is a continuation of what we are already seeing throughout the Western world: contempt for the idea of the “consent of the governed.” People who are economically ‘non-essential’ can have their farms confiscated, their trades (in, say, fossil fuel-related industries) abolished and their right to oppose and change the government criminalised.

  4. Not Trampis says:

    surely we should be seeing quite a of of technological unemployment if he is right.

    such a shame if he was right there would be a lot of people not buying much because they are unemployed.

    People have been mouthing such statements since the Industrial revolution

  5. Lee says:

    If the WEF and the Bill Gates of the world feel that way about the population there is always the ultimate personal sacrifice they can make.
    Go ahead, do it!
    But as always with the elitists, the climate doom-mongers/profiteers, and the WEF, it is only others who have to be sacrificed on the altar of their virtue-signalling.

  6. C.L. says:

    I think he’s talking about disengagement more than unemployment.

  7. Franx says:

    I just wonder why being a materially nonessential person would matter for the WEF types unless being materially nonessential meant that the nonessential person is actually essential in negative terms, eg, in terms of not being amenable to exploitation or corruption, either materially or immaterially.

  8. Jannie says:

    The Zeitgeist that informs the AI that controls the system is going to be anthrophophobic. But it will need some humans to keep the power on.

  9. Riversutra says:

    I thought his forecast for the future was an accurate summary of how the “movers and shakers” expect things to go. He is not on about getting rid of the untermensch but that they will just be sidelined.

    it’s much worse psychologically to feel that you are useless than to feel that you are exploited.

    The advances in bio engineering and computer science (AI will always be “only a few years away”) mean that a LOT of jobs will go and this time the new technologies will not create new ones.
    So, sit at home with your Soma and the great new VR porn set up and welcome to your place in the brave new world.
    This is a serious problem for the future. A future that doesn’t have a meaningful place for many and no place their votes, opinions , hopes and dreams.
    What he is really saying is many people just won’t matter and I see no argument to his reasoning. The Future is Feudal!

  10. Rossini says:

    Why must I go and he chooses to stay!

  11. Shy Ted says:

    Start with people who appear on, judge or watch The Masked Singer.

  12. Fat Tony says:

    Franx says:
    12 August, 2022 at 1:14 pm
    I just wonder why being a materially nonessential person would matter for the WEF types…

    He’s referring to the useless eaters who are consuming their (WEF etc) resources

  13. Tel says:

    Who does he mean “we” ?

    Speaking strictly for myself … I’ve never had a need for Yuval Harari … and probably would be better off in every way without him. That said, I would have at least been content if we both left each other alone … which is more consideration than Harari offered anyone else. I think he’s a fast talking scam artist, good at identifying political buzzwords and jumbling them all together into angsty elevator pitch speeches that some people find profound.

    Might be time he came to understand that other people don’t exist for his benefit, and when he says “we” he sure doesn’t represent me, or any of my friends.

  14. C.L. says:

    I think all y’all are missing his argument.

    He is saying – to my mind – that people no longer see themselves as invested in and central to the technical and socio-economic world around them. That strikes me as correct.

  15. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    He’s a full-on climate looney.
    Does that shed some light on his comments?

  16. C.L. says:

    That may be so, Bruce, but the quotes at the link are historically correct and culturally on point. I’ve tried Googling the whole speech but Breitbart is only linking to the lengthy YouTube audio.

  17. NoFixedAddress says:

    C.L.

    I kind of, sort of, maybe get the point you hold but when someone is speaking as a spokesthingy for Weird EuroWorld Fascists (WEF) I start checking my supplies of gunpowder.

    The EU may be successful in its dominance but it is a basic failed endeavor. A bureaucratic nightmare for all Europeans.

    The latest I saw was they were taking Hungary to some jumped up Euro Wprld Court for Hungary’s stance on LGBTQ+matters.

    The WEF is a global extension of the EU. Socialism on Steroids.

  18. NoFixedAddress says:

    And a sort of PostScript.

    I was under the impression that Western populations were basically in decline anyway with negative population birth rates with only the countries on the African continent having increasing populations.

    Maybe that is his point.

    I don’t consider the world has exploited nearly anything of its resources and this business of digging up rare minerals to make useless renewables and electric cars is a complete and utter waste of those rare resources.

  19. Tel says:

    I’ve tried Googling the whole speech but Breitbart is only linking to the lengthy YouTube audio.

    There’s a different speech, covering similar ideas, here.

    https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/01/yuval-hararis-warning-davos-speech-future-predications/

    I bothered to listen to some of the TED talk, he starts by borrowing from the Francis Fukuyama “End of History” way of describing the 20th Century (without any attempt of attribution) and then he declares that there’s been some kind of “collapse” in the past 5 to 10 years. He defines a “Liberal” in the political sense as anyone who sees liberty as the most important value … but then he fails to note that more and more human freedoms have been taken away.

    As with most of the political class, he muddles up history in terms of technological improvement (which has been used to increase lifespans, etc) and the expansion of government. Not outright saying the bigger government makes your life better, but pointing out the pseudo-correlation.

    He asks, “Why are people in Indiana and Kentucky feeling resentful?”

    Steve Bannon already explained that clearly enough in 2017, after America voted for Trump … jobs were deliberately outsourced to China in order to reduce costs, it had nothing to do with AI or any other thing, it was one group of people competing with another group of people. The lifestyle of the traditional American family has been systematically denigrated in all the mass media, and there’s been a war against Christianity, along with planned racial conflict using tools like CRT and anti-white prejudice.

    Harari can only come up with central planning on top of central planning, and indeed the whole presumption of his discussion from the get go is that simply leaving people alone to get on with things is completely out of the question.

    Then they carry on about personal information, privacy, big data … the nutty idea of an “information tax” and who owns the data. This is a discussion that’s been around in the software industry for decades, read anything from the EFF or Richard Stallman or Eric S. Raymond … the argument on intellectual property is nothing new. Even the stuff about who owns your DNA code is a discussion that has been around from the moment the first DNA got patented.

    Then Harari starts claiming the amazing powers of the medical industry … and we are talking about the same medical industry that spent 100 years trying to figure out whether eggs and meat are good for you and still can’t come up with a reasonable answer on that simple question. These guys aren’t half as smart as they think they are.

  20. C.L. says:

    It seems, then, my difference with Harari would be that I see the resentful as being wholly justified whereas he sees them as an oddity to be ‘fixed’ in some way by technocrats of the WEF variety. On the resentful, the economic liberalisers of the 90s shipped their jobs to China, then told them they were not ‘essential workers’ during the ‘pandemic’ and now expect them to be gung-ho in the coming war against China.

    That’s important to remember in Australia too: the same people who were scoffing at the ‘autarky’ of domestic manufacturing in the late twentieth century segued like innocents to discussing what must be done to insulate ourselves from supply-chain crises in the 21st. Our ruling and commentary classes are total frauds.

  21. Buccaneer says:

    There is already a tax on private data, it’s the cost of complying with privacy legislation

  22. NoFixedAddress says:

    Buccaneer says:
    13 August, 2022 at 12:43 pm

    There is already a tax on private data, it’s the cost of complying with privacy legislation

    LOL

    and the rest… taxation law that runs to how many pages now let alone penalties if you stuff up… not your tax agent but you.

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