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What would be the effect on the budget if
all smokers started smoking “chop chop”
Only no hopers smoke the Chop Chop.
Hasn’t been dried properly, hasn’t been cured.
The Albanese Government is tracking to become a very poor one indeed.
In just this small policy space they have –
Announced a safer alternative to tobacco will be all but banned ; and
Announced a further increase in the enormous tax on tobacco, an extremely regressive tax.
Incoherent, counterproductive and cruel.
Tobacco is a toxic drug, so whatever Albanese does to discourage use is a plus.
Yeah, it doesn’t cause Lung Cancer, but it is strongly associated with mouth, throat and jaw cancer, very unpleasant outcomes.
Ed Case “Only no hopers smoke” No sympathy there , but will accept the tax
revenue though.
It a laffer minute!
Throw them a curve ball.
Chop chop.
If the working class have not yet figured out how much the ALP looks down on the and hates them … I would guess they never will.
Sad, but anytime you have hardworking people, it creates a surplus for others to pilfer … and this is why societies rise and why they fall.
I love prohibition!!
And just imagine how much extra money they will be forced to borrow to pay additional Border Force and AFP personnel to make sure they stop the smugglers and excise dodgers.
Along with increasing immigration out to 2030 what a boost to GPD the increasing excise taxes will be.
I only smoke to show my affluence.
Only no hopers smoke the Chop Chop.
Hasn’t been dried properly, hasn’t been cured.
Chop chop – are you referring to the loose baccy that comes in plastic pouches?
There are also tailor made packaged cigarettes with what looks like Chinese characters on the pack. (But not all the diseased body parts).
I don’t smoke anything so I can’t comment on the quality, but the packaged cigs appear to be quite popular – and a lot cheaper than the local fully taxed/excised/GST’ed items.
I have tried the Cop Chop in central Queensland, and i reckon its better than Drum or similar, and its half the price. It does not have any of the essential oils that are infused in the commercial rolling tobacco (Drum or Port Royal) and is not rough. Some of the Dope growers have turned to tobacco, easier to grow and conceal.
Foxbody. Great point about how regressive these excises etc are….on Tobacco, booze, petrol, you name it. Especially tobacco since it really IS the working-person’s habit these days.
Working class ALP rusted-on gets hit 2 hours wages for a pack of 25 cigarettes….whilst a pack costs the average Nob Hill resident 3 minutes chit-chat. Now THAT’S what
”i call equity, ya Labor F’wits!
Grandpa Ed Simpson
If the Albanese government were serious about the health effects of tobacco, it would that the advice that Alan Jones gave to Nicola Roxon, then Health Minister, over a decade ago: “Ban it, Minister”.
Hint: It will not be banned.
Exactly, Boambee. They won’t ban it. Nor would they ban gambling or alcohol. Australian governments love making money off of people’s vices.
Clearly the intention isn’t to make money off vice, since a packet of Rothmans 25 is $44 and 50g of Drum is $120, the intention is to discourage smoking.
As I said, only no hopers smoke the Chop Chop because:
#1. It’s illegal, and sensible Australians prefer not to have any dealings with criminals
#2. It hasn’t been dried properly or cured at all.
I would say price is definitely the biggest deterrent to smoking for those that still smoke.
Much bigger than lame rubbish like plain packaging and gruesome pictures. For some young lads the more gruesome the picture the better! An incentive to buy a pack to show how tough they are.
But that price definitely creates a black market.
I would say though that the excise probably raises more than smokers cost the health system for example. They drop off earlier and quicker.
I would say though that the excise probably raises more than smokers cost the health system for example. They drop off earlier and quicker.
I think I read some years back that, at that time, smokers allegedly cost the health system $800 million per year, but the gov was collecting $8 billion in excise/taxes.
Anyone have more recent figures?
#1. It’s illegal, and sensible Australians prefer not to have any dealings with criminals
Criminals? Are you referring to the government??
I would say price is definitely the biggest deterrent to smoking for those that still smoke.
Okay.
But that price definitely creates a black market.
Sure, but how significant is it?
The choices are:
#1. Smoke less
#2. Give it away
#3. Go out of your way to find some deadbeat who’ll sell the Chop Chop from under the counter and give up anyway because it’s hardly worth smoking.
How long do you think you could survive in an absence of Government, Fat Tony?
Remember, no Government is going to be Mad Max from Day 1, limiting interactions with Government is just common sense.
Compare and contrast this neo-puritan crackdown on tobacco with the prodigious effort around the country to legalise the use of hard drugs, backed up with free testing and drug sanctuaries in which to indulge.
Winston:
Deaths from Tobacco use are 5 times deaths from Opiate use and 500 times the Maternal death rate.
While I think the continual Tax raise on Tobacco has more sinister motives, if it’s mostly eliminated due to price, that wouldn’t be a bad outcome either.
Ed Case says:
4 May, 2023 at 1:29 pm
Winston:
Deaths from Tobacco use are 5 times deaths from Opiate use and 500 times the Maternal death rate.
Ed, Ed, Ed… “Deaths from Tobacco” are like “Deaths from Speeding”…. Creative.
Who knows. A very quick look
20 million citizens aged 18+
11% are smokers
$14B in excise => ~$7000 donation/smoker
So government is really contributing $5,500 per man woman and child.
Add in excise on sinful alcohol and I’d say the dot govs are making out like bandits.
*of course there is a lot more to this than the simple averages presented above.
Ya gotta laugh at some things, though.
Malhotra on Rogan was all in for autonomy and informed consent and right to choose, but he swelled with pride when he told Joe how he was ‘instrumental’ in getting a sugar tax onto the books.
You severly tanned Scottish git. Are you in for personal autonomy or pushing people around?
The Victorian Cancer Council released a lengthy research paper over a decade ago. I studied it closely and wrote a few posts about it. My memory of the numbers are rough now but I think it concluded that smokers contributed about $7 billion to government revenue while taking back less that $2 billion in health costs. So, yeah, the common line that smokers are a burden on the health system is BS. And, I repeat, this paper came from the Victorian Cancer Council so they had every reason to give it an anti-smoking leaning. But even they couldn’t distort the figures enough to prove that smokers don’t contribute massively to the budget.
You’re missing the point.
Increasing the Tax reduces the number of smokers, which reduces Health Care costs down the road, it’s not rocket science.
I did some construction work at the Cancer Council in Bowen Hills 20 years ago.
Every Tuesday afternoons they hosted a support group for people [all old men] who had had their Larynx removed, which I presume is 99% caused by smoking.
Every hour a group of staff would take a 5 minute break to have a cigarette at the entrance stairs.
All women.
No Ed, you are missing the point. No matter how you massage the figures smokers do not put a net burden on health care costs. The reason is brutal but simple. If they get sick they die fast, or their health care costs are relatively inexpensive. They don’t spend years in hospital beds. Non smokers live longer but could require 20 years of expensive health management in aged care. Your example of seeing sick people at a cancer centre is juvenile. Of course that’s where you are going to see the worst cases.